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inazuma_x
 Post subject: welding up the subframe
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:35 pm 
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looking at buying a new welder (my hand-me-down stick welder died about 6 months back) and am unsure of what would be better for welding RHS etc with about a 4mm wall thickness. stick or mig? mig is considerably more expensive than stick and i have limited experience with mig and quite alot of experience with stick...what would you guys recommend? what have you guys used for subframe fabrication?

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inazuma_x
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:44 pm 
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striped 63 wrote:
On another note - What's with this RHS? You not using tube?


hence the etc...i prolly will use tube...ie. circular cross-section stuff...just wanted to cover all the angles and couldnt remember the acronym for the cylindrical stuff :P

edit: JC? lol you deleted yer post? :P hahaha why?

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awdmoke
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:46 pm 
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If you can weld better with stick, go with that.
Just try and use some decent rods. Use your GPs for tacking up, but use some low hydrogen rods for the structural welds.

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inazuma_x
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:49 pm 
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awdmoke wrote:
If you can weld better with stick, go with that.
Just try and use some decent rods. Use your GPs for tacking up, but use some low hydrogen rods for the structural welds.


coolz :)
i prolly will just be doing the prototype on my own...i have a mate who is a boiler maker by trade and does welding for Energex...thinking of getting him to weld me up the final subframe so it is atleast a pretty decent job :P my welding is really only home-hobby stuff and prolly wouldnt pass engineering :(

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awdmoke
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:57 pm 
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Good plan. Even though I own an engineering firm, I'm a crap welder too :lol:
I design/fabricate/tack weld/assemble, then I pay one of my coded welders to weld everything up. Much safer that way!

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inazuma_x
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 1:24 pm 
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awdmoke wrote:
Good plan. Even though I own an engineering firm, I'm a crap welder too :lol:
I design/fabricate/tack weld/assemble, then I pay one of my coded welders to weld everything up. Much safer that way!


maybe its time to take a tafe course and improve both my stick welding skills and learn some more about mig and tig welding...

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Jules
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 1:55 pm 
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inazuma_x wrote:
looking at buying a new welder (my hand-me-down stick welder died about 6 months back) and am unsure of what would be better for welding RHS etc with about a 4mm wall thickness. stick or mig? mig is considerably more expensive than stick and i have limited experience with mig and quite alot of experience with stick...what would you guys recommend? what have you guys used for subframe fabrication?


4mm wall thickness? That's really heavy gauge for a subframe. If you really are using that then use stick. For something thinner, MIG would be good BUT be careful. It is very easy for the inexperienced to pile on a load of MIG weld which looks OK but doesn't have good penetration (ie. no strength). So if you are going to MIG weld it yourself then do as you suggested and get some good training first.
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inazuma_x
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 2:34 pm 
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Jules wrote:
inazuma_x wrote:
looking at buying a new welder (my hand-me-down stick welder died about 6 months back) and am unsure of what would be better for welding RHS etc with about a 4mm wall thickness. stick or mig? mig is considerably more expensive than stick and i have limited experience with mig and quite alot of experience with stick...what would you guys recommend? what have you guys used for subframe fabrication?


4mm wall thickness? That's really heavy gauge for a subframe. If you really are using that then use stick. For something thinner, MIG would be good BUT be careful. It is very easy for the inexperienced to pile on a load of MIG weld which looks OK but doesn't have good penetration (ie. no strength). So if you are going to MIG weld it yourself then do as you suggested and get some good training first.


well 3-4mm...would need to be atleast 3mm i would have thought...

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gzeVan
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 3:20 pm 
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I have used stick for my sirion subframe
when i did my locksmith certificate i did welding but i stayed back and did the more indepth corses this was done at tafe (mt druitt has a very good set up for this as well as machining)
BUT most of mine im tacking and getting a mate to weld who does it every day for living

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Jules
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:02 pm 
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inazuma_x wrote:
well 3-4mm...would need to be atleast 3mm i would have thought...


Depends on the design. If it was me I would make a more complex structure using thin material, thus ending up with a lighter structure. Look at the existing subframe and some of it is only 1.6mm. But if you are not sure then it's best to play safe and use a heavier gauge.
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inazuma_x
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:18 pm 
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Jules wrote:
inazuma_x wrote:
well 3-4mm...would need to be atleast 3mm i would have thought...


Depends on the design. If it was me I would make a more complex structure using thin material, thus ending up with a lighter structure. Look at the existing subframe and some of it is only 1.6mm. But if you are not sure then it's best to play safe and use a heavier gauge.


thats what i was thinking...basically there are only 3 engine mounts...making those fit in a mini shouldnt be hard (its been done a few times already)...also thicker gauge means you have more room for error...i tend to be a fan of moderate over-engineering...

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Jules
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:33 pm 
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inazuma_x wrote:
also thicker gauge means you have more room for error...


Agreed.

inazuma_x wrote:
i tend to be a fan of moderate over-engineering...


Fair enough. I'm a minimalist :wink:
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JC
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:49 pm 
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inazuma_x wrote:
striped 63 wrote:
On another note - What's with this RHS? You not using tube?


hence the etc...i prolly will use tube...ie. circular cross-section stuff...just wanted to cover all the angles and couldnt remember the acronym for the cylindrical stuff :P

edit: JC? lol you deleted yer post? :P hahaha why?


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inazuma_x
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:52 pm 
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striped 63 wrote:
inazuma_x wrote:
striped 63 wrote:
On another note - What's with this RHS? You not using tube?


hence the etc...i prolly will use tube...ie. circular cross-section stuff...just wanted to cover all the angles and couldnt remember the acronym for the cylindrical stuff :P

edit: JC? lol you deleted yer post? :P hahaha why?


Imposter!


roooooooooight.... :roll:

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awdmoke
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:00 pm 
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CHS Circular Hollow Section
RHS Rectangular Hollow Section
SHS Square Hollow Section

All very technical :roll:

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