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 Post subject: Cam specs comparison
PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2006 4:36 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 1:08 pm
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Location: England
Thought I'd share this with you - nw this IS worth jamming in your memory banks...

http://www.harveycrane.com/secrets10.htm

Recent cufuffels/squabbles over who's acms do what and why various real specialists won't quote data...

Cheers, Keith.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 7:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2005 8:11 pm
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Keiith

the link did not work

cheers

Kiwiinwgtn


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:10 pm 
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Same same Keith - link didnt work either...

Hooroo

Rob Forsyth
Miniot!!

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:33 pm 
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Location: Sydney - strangely, I am glad of the sight of hills!!
ditto

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 9:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 03, 2004 2:56 pm
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Works for me.... :roll:

"VALVE TIMING DIAGRAMS"
HOW CAN THEY LIE TO YOU?

What is a valve timing diagram? Simply put, the numbers like INTAKE OPENS at 20 degrees BTDC (Before Top Dead Center) and CLOSES at 60 degrees ABDC (After Bottom Dead Center), EXHAUST OPENS at 60 degrees BBDC (Before Bottom Dead Center) and CLOSES at 20 degrees ATDC (After Top Dead Center).

This timing may also be written as:
20 - 60
60 - 20
Of course, most of the time these four data points are NEVER ACCOMPANIED WITH THE EXACT CAM LIFT THAT THESE NUMBERS WERE TAKEN AT!

Many times the timing diagram fails to specify the total duration of the timing diagram. Let's calculate the total duration of the intake by simply adding together 20 plus 60 and adding the constant 180 which totals 260. The exhaust will calculate as 60+20+180=260. Let's assume these numbers were taken at .050 inches of cam lift.

Now the timing may be written as:
20 - 60 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift
60 - 20 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift

Now let's play GAMES WITH THIS TIMING DIAGRAM. If we ADVANCE THE CAM 5 crankshaft degrees the SAME timing diagram becomes:

25 - 55 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift
65 - 15 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift

Notice that the left side numbers INCREASE by FIVE and the right side numbers DECREASE by FIVE.

If we RETARD THE CAM 5 crankshaft degrees from the ORIGINAL timing diagram it becomes:

15 - 65 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift
55 - 25 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift

Notice that the left side numbers DECREASE by FIVE and the right side numbers INCREASE by FIVE.

Remember, all three of these timing diagrams are from the SAME CAMSHAFT! Only the ADVANCE AND RETARD of the camshaft IN REFERENCE to the CRANKSHAFT has been changed!

Let's play another camshaft "SELLERS" GAME. (Sellers don't make cams, only package other manufacturers camshafts). Using the SAME intake and exhaust lobe specifications, the MAKER of the camshaft CLOSES the LOBE CENTERLINE (SEPARATION) 5 CAM DEGREES and the NEW timing diagram becomes:

25 - 55 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift
55 - 25 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift

Notice that each of the "OVERLAP" numbers INCREASE by FIVE crankshaft degrees. Overlap should be called "CROSSOVER AREA" to be correct.

The original 20-60-60-20 camshaft had a LOBE CENTERLINE of 110.0 CAMSHAFT DEGREES.

This "NEW" camshaft has a LOBE CENTERLINE of 105 camshaft degrees.

This CENTERLINE is BUILT INTO THE CAMSHAFT and cannot be changed by the engine builder. But, he may ADVANCE OR RETARD the camshaft in reference to the crankshaft. This WILL NOT CHANGE THE "LOBE CENTERLINE" but will change the MAXIMUM LIFT POINT (sometimes also called CENTERLINE).

If we RETARD this new "TIGHT CENTERLINE" Camshaft 5 crankshaft degrees from the ORIGINAL timing diagram it becomes:

20 - 60 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift
50 - 30 = 260.0 @ .050" cam lift

Before cam duration can be matched to an engines operating range, the EXACT CAM LIFT must be specified AT WHERE THE DURATION IS COMPUTED.

If a statement is made "this cam has 260 degrees of duration", without adding "260 degrees at .050", the duration number of 260 degrees is TOTALLY USELESS.

That's why knowledgeable engine builders usually select a camshaft based on its duration at .05000" cam lift. In addition to being more accurate than "advertised duration" as an indication of a cams performance potential, duration at .05000" lift applies almost universally, regardless of camshaft make, model or manufacturer.

When comparing camshaft specifications, the best way to cut through the confusion is to focus on duration at .050" lift and lobe separation. These two figures will provide a solid indication of a cams performance characteristics.

"HAPPY CAM ANALYSIS TO YOU"

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 9:04 pm 
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ET 13.457 seconds , OH YEAH !!!!
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Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 8:35 am
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works for me...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 24, 2006 11:26 pm 
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There was an issue earlier today (Friday, 10 to 11 am my time so early evening your time) - but it works fine now. Thanks for posting the full article striped 63 - I hope as many folks as possible will read it. It'll cut down on the arguments about whos cams compare with whose... KC.

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Tuning should always be a compromise between what is possible and what is necessary.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2006 6:10 am 
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Cmon - when I was growing up in Toowoomba in QLD it was always a big pissing contest to see who could spin the biggest fib about their camshaft - I even had a fellow telling me he had a 35/75 camshaft ....IN A 12a ROTARY

Jokes aside - very helpful info - thanks both of you

Hooroo

Rob Forsyth
Miniot!!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2006 7:52 am 
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Location: Plumpton, NSW
CPOCSM wrote:
when I was growing up in Toowoomba in QLD

Rob Forsyth
Miniot!!


Have you got the red dirt off your shoes yet?
I had/have a lot of family in Toowoomba. (Hillview Ave, Tancred st, and more recently fleet st)
:)
KB


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