| ausmini https://ausmini.com/forums/ |
|
| Weber vs. Specialist Components Injection https://ausmini.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=77779 |
Page 1 of 2 |
| Author: | JC [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | Weber vs. Specialist Components Injection |
So I'm running the numbers on which path to take. Say a Weber fitted is going to owe me ~$500 fitted. I'm then up for ~$300 for distributor, ignition leads and coil (plus say brackets and what not). So ~$800 for fuel and ignition, plus tuning. The Specialist Components fuel injection kit is going to owe me ~$1700 landed. That kit resolves both fuel and spark. So in a like for like comparison (price) the SC kit appears considerably more expensive. So why would I consider it? Fuel economy, throttle reponse, putting around town driving, more likely to handle fitment of A/C better than a weber and ease of forced induction later on. I haven't included twin SU's in on this comparison as the prices they seem to be attracting at the moment is offensive (for what they are). |
|
| Author: | meeni [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Still need to tune the ecu, factory tune will work but probably not be 100% so add cost there.. But once that's done, you've got something that will be perfect at every stage of the rev range. Depending on how you use the car, every day I'd say injection without a doubt but for a weekender etc I probably can't see any major benefit, it won't make any more horsepower (maybe 1 or 2) then a properly tuned carby.. |
|
| Author: | kirby [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:11 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Injection is clearly better, that's why every modern car uses it. Injection will be easier to tune all things considered. You can try several tunes with the click of a mouse much faster than it takes to change jets etc on a Webber. If price is the decider don't rule out a megasquirt. Cheaper and all the common engine configurations have been tuned to within an inch of other life by he UK crowd, including sequential Siamese injection. Is that 500 figure including a manifold and possibly firewall mods, because it seems rather cheap. |
|
| Author: | JC [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:21 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
kirby wrote: Is that 500 figure including a manifold and possibly firewall mods, because it seems rather cheap.
There are plenty around including manifold/airfilter for around that price. The Manifold/Air Filter I would purchase would not warrant firewall modifications. Also, the S/C kit is a complete kit, no dicky around having to source and other components. Sean, yeah I had figured in a like for like comparison the tuning cost of either would be equal (but of course with the injection you can retain each tune). JC |
|
| Author: | Smarty [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 12:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Don't forget to add the cost of other jets and chokes etc for your weber, and then you have to pay someone to tune it if you cant do it yourself. Also if its second hand probably a gasket and oring kit for it too. (I do like the sound of a weber though....) 
|
|
| Author: | drmini in aust [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 4:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
How much HP do these throttle bodies really give on a siamese port head? Is anybody racing successfully anywhere with 5 port heads and injection? |
|
| Author: | slide [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 6:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
How will a TB set up sound in comparison to a Weber? IMO it's prettty hard to beat a Weber / A series combination. |
|
| Author: | graham in aus [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 7:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Sounds like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YEEgaUf3Rk You're Question answered on You Tube! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DzU9QBAr ... ure=relmfu
|
|
| Author: | Kennomini [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 8:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I assume they'd sound very similar seeing as it's either one or two large inlet pipes. The sucking sound from the air rushing in through those pipes is going to be almost exactly the same IMO. |
|
| Author: | JC [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
drmini in aust wrote: How much HP do these throttle bodies really give on a siamese port head?
Is anybody racing successfully anywhere with 5 port heads and injection? Is this particular example it makes no more or less than a weber, they claim better lower end drivability however, which to me is more important for a road car (with the same power output when required). http://www.twinkam.co.uk/shop/article_S ... 08B.001%26 I understand the intent of your question regarding out and out race cars doc, but when was the last time you saw a formula one car in traffic? |
|
| Author: | meeni [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 9:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
if you can afford it go for it, i guess you will forever be able to use it regardless of the engine you use. another couple of expenses to add that i forgot about are different fuel tank with return lines, high pressure fuel pump and a regulator. i like the idea of injection its just quite expensive for a little bit of refinement. |
|
| Author: | Mokesta [ Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
The YouTube vid of that on the Dyno doesn't suggest to me that it runs too much better than a weber down low. I am yet to be convinced that these can successfully get around the charge robbing issue. They must have small capacity injectors working hard or very rapid pulsing of larger injectors to get the flow to be as constant air/fuel mix as possible down the inlet tract. I bet they run two cylinders richer than the others but is it down to a manageable level where they are not too rich to foul and not too lean to burn out? Is it successful over a wide range of revs? I think this SC kit would be great with a blower between the injectors and the inlet. It would mash the charge up and make it virtually homogeneous so the charge robbing would be cured. People keep saying the fuel tank must be modified but i don't think so. There is plenty of room under the tank to put a 1-2 litre swirl pot. This can be gravity fed from the tank. It could have a tall vent pipe to higher than the filler cap. It could have the fuel pump feed out the bottom and return line in the top tangential to the side. In fact, these days many cars run the fuel pressure regulator at the rear and a single dead-end line to the engine so you can even get away without running feed and return fuel lines if you want. Fuel temp could be your only issue for the single line system. At the pump,size required for a mini it wouldnt be a problem for the two line plus return to swirl pot set up. External injection pumps are commonly available for the price of a rover injection tank. |
|
| Author: | KLAS [ Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
what about a different way? just put any cheap throttle body injection on. most older ones can be reprogrammed if needed as quite a lot of people are working on this systems. my 998ccm engine running a GM Multec/Delco setup. being made by a big company it starts and idles perfect and is dirt cheap. cost me less than 50€ for the parts incl loom. running a bit rich as the ECU was made for a 1400ccm engine. http://youtu.be/tKcGib_PcoE can be made better for sure, but for a quick and dirty job i like it a lot |
|
| Author: | TheMiniMan [ Fri Jul 27, 2012 9:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hey John, yep i`d inject it. once you`ve driven an injected mini,,, well you`ll know why once you have 
|
|
| Author: | NG [ Fri Jul 27, 2012 9:46 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Jc mine should be going very soon, it is getting Dyno tuned & few small other things done i cant do with out a hoist. just hold off & pop over I'm only up the road from you. i agree with matt, injection is the way.. or you could make this looks simple enough. 
|
|
| Page 1 of 2 | All times are UTC + 10 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|